I do agree that the future rail travel is w/short haul-regional service. I like what IL & MI have done going into this format. I have brought this up is coffee chat and have received some strange looks, but would abolishing all long distance service, taking that equipment (rebuilding slpr cars & diners into coaches) to create daylight short haul service actually create more ridership and interest in Amtrk? I live on the route of the Southwest Chief,both trains stop in town during the 3:am hour. It gets hard for a city to promote that type of rail service and it gets more difficult to get up @ 2’am yr after yr to catch the train as i’m now in mid age. I understand that that a 2256 mile long train has to stop in the middle of night somewhere, but i’d give up 3&4 for a daytimer regional train to say Kan City or Okla City anytime.
Hi,Im from Missouri(The Show Me State) and from my perseptive it looks like NARP with their “GROW RAIL” campaign are on the right “TRACK” WITH KANSAS CITY STANDS TO GAIN 4-6 TRAINS DAILY WITH ONE BIG EXCEPTION.WHILE THEY WOULD RUN A NORTBOUND TRAIN TO OMAHA,SIOUX CITY,SIOUX FALLS ETC.AT OMAHA CONNECTING WITH THE CALIFORNIA ZEPHR TO DENVER AND WEST,STILL AND THIS WAS NOT INCLUDED IN NARPS GRID NO DIRECT TRAIN FROM KANSAS CITY TO DEBNVER WHICH IN DOING A VERY INFOMAL SURVEY MOST KANSAS CITY PERSONS ESPECIALLY SKIERS WOULD LOVE TO HAVE THIS TRAIN BACK.AS IT NOW STANDS SKIERS UNLESS THEY DRIVE TO CO,UT & ETC,CAN RIDE A VERY HARD OVERNIGHT SLEEPER BUS TO GET THERE.I THINK THAT IF NARP WERE TO INCLUDE THIS KANSAS CITY-DENVER TRAIN IT WOULD BE THE BEST THING TO HAPPEN.THE TRAIN COULD EVEN ORIGINATE IN ST.LOUIS,MAKING THE SAME CONNECTIONS AT NIGHT WITH THE SOUTHWEST CHIEF AND THEN CNTINUE TO DENVER TO MEET THE ZEPHYR.OF COURSE YOU ARE DEALING WITH THE U.P.,WHICH HAS A VERY POOR RECORD ONN PASSENGER TRAINS ON ITS SYSTEM,COMPARED TO THE BNSF WHICH GIVE PASSENGER TRAINS PRIORITY, I AM ANARP MEBER MYSELF SINCE THE LATE 90’S AND HAVE BEEN TO WASHINGTON TO MEET WITH NARPS EXCUTIVE DIRECTOR.
Is this a matter of our national pride being turned inside-out? I’m picking up a bit of “If we can’t have the best, then nothing at all” from a couple of the above posts. Which ignores the fact that there are lots of foreign HST train-makers, for example, who would love to show us the state of the art – after their gov’ts have picked up the tab for the R&D. (Us, we do the same thing indirectly with our big pharma houses, through federally-subsidized university research and protective legislation).
Look, we can either buy the dang things or not. Most people do understand the concept of a “balanced transportation system,” but where’s the money? Should the U.S. gov’t sell Fannie Mae-like bonds for railroad acquisition and rehab? There are a couple of states who have declarted themselves HST-ready, laid out routes and then . . . nothing happens. Is the United States now becoming the land of “can’t do”? as opposed to the “can do” attitude that got us to the moon and built the Interstate highways? How depressing. - a. s.
Al I agree about the “can’t do” attitude. I think a lot of the “can’t do” folks are looking backwards at the economics of passenger trains over the last 50 years and projecting the same scenario on the next 50 years. But the world is changing. Energy efficient, environmentally friendly technologies are the wave of the future, and modern passenger trains are ideally suited for that future. Ageing baby boomers will be looking for more comfortable and relaxed ways to travel, and trains can tap into that emerging market. Highways are more hectic than ever, and airline travel ain’t exactly glamourous anymore. Trains have the potential to provide a comfortable, convenient and competitive alternative. Some people say “why?” I say “why not?”
IM LOOKING AT THIS DIFFERENTLY THAN MOST OF THE REPLIES SO FAR.WHEN NARP OF WHICH I AM AN ACTIVE MEBER FROM LEES SUMMIT,MO IT SEEMED THAT NARP WAS TRYING TO ESTABLISH NEW AND IMPROVING EXSISTING SERVICE TO THE LOWER 48. I AGREE SOME OF THE SERVICE THEY PROPOSE WOULD NOT INVOLVE LD TRAINS.IN THE CASE OF KANSAS CITY AREA,MORWE REGINAL TRAINS WOULD BR ADDED TO THE GRID TOAUGMENT THE EXSISTING LD TRAINS.MISSOURI AT PRESENT DESPITE THE LACK OF MO GOV COOPERSATION IS STILL LOOKING AT EESTABLISHING A ST LOUIS TO SPRINFIELD/JOPLIN WHERE THE OKLANHOMA DOT WOULD PICK UP AND EXTENED THE TAIN TO TULSA/OK CITY TO CONNECT WITH THE HEARLAND FLYER TO DLS/FT WORTH.SIMILIAR KANSAS DOT IS ALSO RETHNKING THEIR POSITION TO REESTABLISH THE KANSAS CITY-WICHITA-OKLAHOMA CITY,CONNECTING ON THE NORTH END WITH THE SOUTHWEST CHIEF AND WITH THE HEARTLAND FLYER. THERE IS MORE BUT ILL GO INTO THAT LATER WHEN I RECEIVE REPLIES TOTHIS POST
GRAND AVE,
Northern Flyer Alliance is sponsoring a public meeting for state legislators and passnegerrailks.org at Kansas City Union Station on December 8th, 9:00am - 12 noon in the Jarvis Hunt Room off the main hall. It is a public meeting-meaning open and free. The Northern Flyer Alliance just had a similar meeting in Topeka on October 20th. See www.northflyer.org
Oklahoma Department of Transportation has issued a request for study to Amtrak this week. Governor Henry of Oklahoma has been asked by an Oklahoma House member to write a letter to Governor Sebelius of Kansas requesting discussion of a possible bi-state compact. U.S. Senate bill S-294 looks like it will probably pass. A quad cities “Alliance” is moving forward on extending passenger rail service (inter-city) into Iowa from Rock Island, Illinois. Nebraska has a similar organization.
I was really impressed with the vision NARP has in regard to what the national system should look like down the road. While I don’t agree with ALL the possible route extensions/additions, here are some no-brainers that are LONG overdue:
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Restoring service on the I-25 Corridor - If Amtrak were to add only one route to it’s current system, this would HAVE to be the choice - hands down. Anybody currently traveling on I-25 between Denver and Colorado Springs alone will tell you what a nightmare it is to travel on that segment.
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Twin Cities - Kansas City - Another corridor that needs service. What a complete and utter joke it is that you currently have to backtrack to Chicago to connect with service to the West Coast. Presumably, the UP’s former CNW “Spine Line” mainline would be the ideal choice here.
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Alternative Chicago-Omaha service - I’ve always advocated of rerouting the CZ from current BNSF (nee CB&Q) to the CNW’s portion of UP’s “Overland Route” mainline. But, because UP is seemingly adamant about keeping Amtrak off of its showcase mainline the other choice would be the Iowa Interstate’s Chicago-Omaha route (former Rock Island). The problem here is that there would have to be a LOT of work done just to get it up to Class 4 or 5 status.
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Chicago - Dubuque - Waterloo - An extension of the Blackhawk route from Chicago to Dubuque to Waterloo on the CN’s Iowa Division mainline (ex IC, ICG, CC).
Samantha, this is not trying to return to the 50’s. This is trying to get the current system into the 21st century.
Denver-Colorado Springs-Pueblo would make sense as a Section 403 operation, but don’t bet on the State of Colorado making any contributions.
Minneapolis-Kansas City service vanished prior to the onset of Amtrak, around 1965 on the CGW and around 1970 o
MR.TOY.
AS YOU WELL KNOW NARP IS A MEMBERSHIP GROUP.THEY GET NO FEDERAL FUNDING,SO THEIR RESOURCES ARE ,LIMITED.THIS IS WHY NOT EVERYONE KNOWS ABOUT NARP.I HAVE BEEN TO WASJHINGTON DC MANY TIMES TO MEET WITH ROSS CAPON EXEC DIRECTOR,NEWS COLUMNISTS WHO COVERED TRANSPORTATION AMTRAK OFFICIALS ETC. HAV E YOU EVER HAD THE CHANCE TO MEET ANY OF NARPS OFFICIALS LIKE I HAVE.
I SUPPORT NARP WITH A YEARLY TAX FREE DONATATION ONCE A YEAR BESIDES MY REG MEBERSHIP FEE.NARP HAS THE ABILITY TO MEET WITH FWEDERAL OFFICIALS ,SENATORS,REPRESENATIVIES ETC.NARP HAS TESTIFIED MANY TIMES BEFORE VARIOUS COMMITTIES IN WASHINGTON ON AMTRAK MATTERS,AND THEY RE THE BEST FRIEND AMTRAK HAS IN WASHINGTON D.C.
LIKE YOU WHEN I GO TO WASHINGTON I RIDE THE CAAPTIOL LIMITED FROM CHICAGO CONNECTING THERE WITH THE TRIP FROM MY HOME BASE.I HAVE HAD THE OPPORTNITY TO TALK TO AMTRAK PASSENGERS,AND YES I AGREE THE MAJORITY OF PASSENGERS DONT REALLY KNOW WHO NARP IS,BUT THHAN GOD I DO AND CAN TALK TO PASSENGERS ABOUT NARP
GRAND AVE-MO.
Anyone advocating before legislators, policy makers and/or planners would do well to bring up the rating shown in the December 4, 2007, issue of PARADE magazine. When I voted on Sunday, the one-item survey was “Should Congress commit more money to America’s trains?” It got a whopping ninety-seven percent “Yes.”
Site is Parade.com .
a.s.
I would discount the probative value of this poll right from the start. The respondents are unlikely to be a representative sample, opponents on such a question probably ignored the article and consequently wouldn’t see the web address for the poll.
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Denver-Colorado Springs-Pueblo would make sense as a Section 403 operation, but don’t bet on the State of Colorado making any contributions.
Minneapolis-Kansas City service vanished prior to the onset of Amtrak, around 1965 o
Rather than quote the message above, I’ll comment on one item from it:
QUAD Cities passenger rail coalition has made great strides since summer in getting service headed west from Rock Island into Quad Cities and beyond. Amtrak officials were in Des Moines yesterday, presumably about this, and although the train isn’t a’comin’ around the bend this morning, the Iowa group is a’waitin’ the specifics of the Amtrak study (a necessary part of the process) before the end of the year.
Kansas DOT has issued a similar request for study (back in July), following the pattern of schedule, they may hear about their results in mid-Spring '08.
Unfortunately, NARP isn’t leading these efforts. Most of them are grass-routes (pun intended) organizations, that may have NARP members, but these aren’t NARP campaigns.
why do youm insist that there would be no mviable traffic between the Twin Cities-Des Moines-Kansas City on thru Kansas via Wichita,Oklahoma City,Dls-Ft Worth and thenon to southern Texas Cities much like the Texas Chief on the Santa Fe ran even after the advent of Amtraki. In think Napr has taken into consideration of trying to establish or reestablishing service to towns that no longer have service.Please read all the comments before you decide what is right nor wrong with this.Obsviously since you are in California you really dont have a good feeling about us Midwesterners, Thats just my thought, Regards,Grand Ave,Mo
HI PRAIRIE TYPE,STILL NOT SURE WHERE YOU LIVE,BUT I GATHER THAT YOU LIKE ME WILL BE AT THE NORTHERN ALLIANCE MEETING.I E MAILED THE EXEC DIRECTOR IN WICHITA.I ADVISED HIM I HAVE INVITED ROD MASSMAN FROM MODOT,RAILROADS DIRECTOR,TODAY I EMAILED 2 COULMINISTS FRONM THE KANSAS CITY STAR,KIT WAGAR AND BRAD COOPER, WHO COVER TRANSIT ISSUES FOR MO BOTH LOCAL AND NATIONAL,AND ARE IN JEFFERSON CITRY WHEN THE LEGISLATURE IS IN SESSION.HOPE IGET TO MEET YOU IN PERSON.
GRAND AVE,MO
I know about the upcoming meeting from their website information and seeing stories about other public meetings they have held in Topeka, and Wichita. This has been on on the news quite often since last February. If at all possible I want to go to the meeting at Union Station, because this is the first public meeting that has been scheduled in Kansas City to my knowledge.
AL,THIS REALLYNDOESNT HAVE MUCH TO DO WITH NARPS GRID /GATEWAY PLAN,BUT IM CURIUOS ABOUT YOUR LOCATION I WORKED AS A TIVCKET AGENT BOTH AT ADAMS ST ,CHICAGO AND 6TH ST AT MILWAUKEES FOR THE DEFUNCT NORTH SHORE.DI YOU BY ANY CANCE ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE NORTH SHORE BACK THEN .OF COURSE I AM TALKING ABOUT OVER 40 YRS AGO. BY THE WAY NORTHERN ALLIANCE AS YPU KNOW IF YU HAVE BEEN READING THE POSTS.ARE4 SPONSORING AN OPEN FORUM AT KANSAS CITY’S UNION STATION ON DWECEMBER 8,2007.IF YOU HAVE THE FUNDS WHY NOT HOP ON THE SOUTHWEST CHEIF FRIDZAY NIGHT AND STAY AROUND FOR THE MEETING.THERE ARE 2 VER FINE HOTELS WIITHIN 2 BLOCKS OF UNION STATION,HYATT REGENCY,WESTIN CROWN CTR. HOPE TO SE YOU THERE,FRANK,GRAND AVE,MO.
Re: No. 4 above. About two years ago Amtrak did try overnight service between Chi and Waterloo (don’t know about Dubuque). The train was supposed to have been subsidized by hauling express packages. Unfortunately, since the package express
WHEN YOU SUGGESTED THAT AMTRAK REROUTE THE CZ OVER THE FORMER CNW/UP OVERLAND RTE,I HOPE YOU ARENT SERIOUS.UP’S RECORD ON THE TRAINS IN THEIR SYSTEM IS SO DEPLORABLE WHY R9ISK THE SAME THING AGAIN.UP HAS THE CZ WEST OF DENVER TO CA AND IT NEVER IS VERY RARELY ON TIME DEPITE AMTRAK EVEN EXRTENDING THE TRAVEL TIME BY 3 NHRS BETWEEN DENVER AND CA.BNSF HANDLES THE TRAIN BETWEEN CHI AND DVR AND IT ON TIME PERFORMANCE IS AT 85% OR BETTER. GRAND AVE,MO
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Re: No. 4 above. About two years ago Amtrak did try overnight service between Chi and Waterloo (don’t know about Dubuque). The train was supposed to have been subsidized by hauling express packages. Unfortunatel