Evidently and according to the CNN story (see link below), the two monorail trains at Orlando Disney World collided at about 2 a.m. this morning and the operator of the “following” train was killed. My condolences to the operator’s family. It seems strange that this would happen given the many thousands of times since the park opened that these trains have operated. More to come I am sure.
http://www.cnn.com/2009/US/07/05/u.s.disney.monorail/index.html
Yeah, that is something I would have never thought of happening at Disney. I have ridden the monorail many times and the trains were always spaced far apart.
Rich
My deepest thoughts go out to his family.
I too concure. This seems to bee a well-run operation. It is suprising to me that this would happen. It says the operator was killed. I wouldn’t be suprised if Disney puts ATC in all of the monarails, and just has an operater inside to watch over, and make sure that the system is functning properly. This would be very expensive though. Maby not though.
…First, we’re sorry to hear of the fatality…
The news sure surprises me…and all I know about it is just what is in the news report provided here…
Believe the 2am time would be suspect to me…knowing no details though.
Have ridden this facility many, many dozens of times and hearing this is a real surprise of how this could happen.
Have noted trains stop back about a quarter of a mile {at least}, when one is in the Contemporary Hotel or in a station stop ahead…Have been in the operators cab and watched signals and how the operators perform, etc…
What a tragedy at the least for the operator and family and the Disney operation.
Surprising to me that the park would be open or even have anyone there at 2am ?
This article says that the crash happened while guests were leaving the park after a July 4th fireworks display.
Wonder if they use the same Software as the DC Metro?
I don’t know, but if it is, I sure think that ALL!!! of these systems should go through a good round of FRA inspecting before allowed to run again.
Just my [2c]
Operating hours {in the past from our experiences}, are longer this time of the year…and this would be close to the time they would be making their last runs of the “day” and preparing to take the units to the “barn”…
The reports indicate that the train was on its very last run and the parks were likely open that late because last night would have had extra festivities for the 4th of July.
Despite the fact that this system is different from the system apparently at fault in the DC crash, it does raise questions about automatic train control system considering that this makes 10 fatalities in the last 2 weeks because of what are quite likely signal system failures (assuming Disney’s system was enabled at the time of the crash). Here is a link to a Monorail FAQ including a discourse on their signalling.
http://www.hiddenmickeys.org/Secrets/Monorails.html
It might well be time for everyone to put their ATC systems on manual operation until we know what happened in these two accidents considering MBTA also had a recent near-miss. Not to mention, the questions this raises for PTC…
Why do we let computers run things again?
If man makes it…it can fail.
If man operates it … it can fail.
There is NOTHING that can’t fail.
Because letting humans run things doesn’t always work, either…
Disney Has these “Extra Magic Hours” before. Its exclusive for those staying at a Disney Hotel. I know the Magic Kingdom can be up as late at 3 am.
Disney World always has a reason to be open late. They have a lot of things going on including staying open late for High Schools to have a graduation trip. This is a tragedy and I am sure there will be quite an investigation.
…From the additional photos I’ve seen, it appears the accident happened at the transportation center. The location where one can choose the Monorail, boat ferry, and or busses to move about to various locations in the Kingdom.
And…if coming from Epcot, transfer over to a monorail route to head to the hotels…or the people mover {surface}, tram to the parkinglot.
I think computers are actually safer… They don’t have the massive issue of crew fatigue associated with them. Humans make mistakes. Computers don’t. They do exactly what they are told to do. Mistakes happen when they are told (either by a human or another computer, like a track detection circuit) to do something they shouldn’t. Or when they don’t get told a vital piece of information, like “there’s a train in the next block!”
Zug’s got it right, IMHO. Remember - all computers are designed, constructed, programmed, installed, adjusted, modified, updated, replaced, and maintained by humans - that’s more than enough opportunity for something to go wrong.
Still skeptical [Q] OK, then you should read -
The Accident That Couldn’t Happen
Trains, October 1965 page 23
collision between CB&Q and RI trains 9/25/64, Montgomery, Illinois [also known as the Streator Branch Junction - PDN]
( ACCIDENT, CB&Q, MONTGOMERY, RI, “SHAW, ROBERT B.”, TRN )
'The Devil at 37,000 Feet’ by William Langewiesche, Vanity Fair magazine, January 2009, at - http://www.vanityfair.com/magazine/2009/01/air_crash200901
[RWM gets the credit for making me - and us - aware of this one, about 3 months ago]
and see the 1960’s movie '2001 - A Space Odyssey’ - esp. the HAL 9000 computer.
I realize a large part of the vehicle bodies are a form of fiberglass, but seeing how it telescoped into the other upon hitting…really surprised me. I would have imagined front end protection would have had more integrity by design.
Supposedly, this was all from human error. The MAPO system was on override, and this is what caused MAPO to not stop the train. However, several people were at fault, probably because of all of the holiday confusion.
Just as an aside, does it bother anyone that the news says:
“OSHA is investigating the cause”?
They are investigating the accident to determine the cause. The cause cannot be investigated, it already happened; we just don’t know what the cause is. I think this is a change in English that has crept into the language.