I do not have HP Photoshop and use Microsoft MSPaint and Photo Editor, often in combination. When I use my Leica or copy a friends digital camera image where the camera is rotated to take a “portrait” image instead of a"landscape," the digital file needs to be rotated in a computer, and I use either of the above programs. In all cases, I find that the 90-degree rotation distorts the image. After the rotation, I need to use MSPaint and 106% width, 100% height to restore the image to avoid obvious visual distortion, obvious if for example comparing the front of a locomotive in a portrait picture with the same in a landscape picture.
Is this a generic problem? Is it possibly peculiar to Microsoft Windows programs that are “Hebrew Enabled?” Normal correspondance paper and pads in the USA have proportions about comparable to the old Kodachrome slilde proportions rotated 90-degrees. But Israel and Europe use the “A4” format which is slightly longer in height and thinner. So perhaps the distortion is deliberate?
Dave:
I’m quite sure that it’s not the program you’re using. To test this, rotate an image and save it under a different name. Open “My Computer” to display the directory that contains the files. Select the original image. In the “Details” panel of “My Computer” look at the Dimensions. Let’s say it’s 800x600, (widthxheight in pixels). Now highlight the version that’s been rotated. It should show the dimensions exchanged, i.e. 600x800. If not, then it is the program that’s the problem.
The other possibility would be monitor settings. Make or get an image that is perfectly square, say 600x600, and display on your monitor. Then with a ruler carefully measure the width and height. The dimensions should be exactly equal. A reason they may not be is that the display properties you may be using may result in this distortion, usually because the setting is not in the monitor’s “native” mode. Right click on the background and open Display Properties and go to the settings tab to try different screen resolutions. The one you should use should be the manufacturer’s recommended resolution.
Where is the problem happening? Is it distorted in your photo program? Check to be sure that the height and width numbers are linked, that is will change proportionally. If not, that is a simple click on your program. Once the rotation is made, it is possible to click on one of the edges and move it, this would be independent of the other dimensions and will cause distortion. By grabbing the photo by the corner it SHOULD maintain proportionality, but not always, for this depends on the program. Perhaps holding the shift key (or some other key particular to your program) will keep proportions while adjusting the size.If this does not solve your p[roblem, you need a better photo program.
Once in a browser, it may be that the HTML specifies a certain size frame, and the browser will distort the photo to fit the frame. This is somewhat beyond your control unless you are building the web page HTML yourself. Clicking on a photo, be it in a link or not, may or may not present the photo unadjusted by the Browser in a new window. That of course, depends on the browser. You can always right click on a photo and select “view” and this will do the same thing.
ROAR
I concur with Eastside… the problem is probably the aspect ratio of the monitor’s pixels. The monitor’s pixels are often not square, usually being wider than they are tall, so images of people make them look fat (quite upsetting to the fair sex). The display driver is “supposed” to correct for this, but that often causes problems with fine detail, either causing narrow vertical or horizontal lines to vary in width or some of the lines to dissappear. Throw into the mix that the camera taking the photo may not have had square sensors and the combination of the two can produce very distorted images as they are moved from one display system to another.
It is not the monitor, it is in the programs themselves, because it shows up when I print, either printing directly from Photo Editor or by pulling up the picture into a Word file, WinWord 2001, 2003, or 2007, and printing from Word. Since none of you have noticed the problem in your use of these MS programs, I assume is it a problem associated with Hebrew enabled computers only, and related by the local Microsoft
People’s efforts to maximize convenient use of the A4 fomat paper used here.
Photoshop is Adobe, not HP. None of the programs you mentioned will in any way distort your image when rotating it. It has to be your monitor. Be sure the settings in your video output match the native resolution of the monitor. You will find the adjustments on Control Panel on the start menu. Do not “fix” the image after you rotate it. Fixing it so it looks right on your monitor will distort it when you print it.
Since you mentioned the different paper proportions:
Some printer drivers and program printer outputs have the ability to modify the image to fit the paper. Make sure that function is turned off if it is present. Don’t make borderless prints. Print actual size and trim the paper.
It does not depend on the monitor. I use quite a variety of computers with different monitors and the same thing happens consistantly. It even happens when I used Photo Editor or Paint in my old laptop Windows 98. But all these windows programs are local and are Hebrew enabled, none are from the States. (i moved here in the 311 Dos 622 days, 1996.) So I guess I have to live with it and use 106/100 correction whenever I rotate. I do not print without boarders and I do not use print to page but use the scale up and scale down arrows to get the picture to the size I want on the page (from Phtoto Editor). And of course the horizontal and vertical scales track together, I can be assured of that. Somehow if you folks never saw this effect in your computers I have to place the sitiuation scarely on the local product and its being Hebrew (and Arabic) enabled. This also means that our word programs can go right to left as well as left to right. I have to make sure I am going in the right direction with the right language! Sort of like of an American trying to drive in Great Britain.
I don’t deny that it might be a problem with the programs being Hebrew and Arabic enabled, but I’d like to know a bit more and ask if you might try some experiments to help “prove” it… just for fun(?).
Does this only happen with images created from one model of camera? Just like monitors and printers, not all cameras have “square” pixels. It could be that the download of those images is not taking into account the aspect ratio of the camera’s pixels and thus creating the problem at the source end of things.
Can you obtain images from other sources (an image from some thread on this forum would be a place to get one) and rotate it with your computer and see if it also exhibits this anomaly?
Another thing to do would be to crop an image to a perfect square by pixel number (say, 400 x 400) and then measure it on the screen and on paper. Then rotate the image and check the pixel count for both X and Y to see if it is still the same, and again measure it on screen and paper to see how it changed.
I know that screwy things happen to images due to mistakes made by the programmers when they didn’t fully understand the relationships of image sensor to the display system aspect ratios. And there is hardware between those two places that can screw it up, not just software.
I also have found that more and more software tries to be “helpful” and makes “adjustments” to the data everytime it touches it, even if just making a copy of it. So it is very possible that the person that created the Hebrew and Arabic enabling may have needed to do the aspect “correction” on their “work” PC and it had some problem that your PC does not have and so the “fix” on the original work PC creates a problem on all the others and you are the lucky person to discover it!
Copy this image to your computer. It should be perfectly square. Print it. It should still be square.
Rotate it 90 degrees and repeat.
Let us know the results.
I ran that experiment already, with a line square, not filled in, rotating it within the picture instead of rotating the picture itself. The same thing happened. I could superimpose one square on the other and found that the sqaure that was rotated was now a rectangle and not a square!
This was done with the MSPaint program, but I am pretty sure the same will apply with Photo Editor’s rotation. Of course the comparison will have to be done in Paint anyway, since Photo Editor does not permit combining, or at least I have not figured out how to combine in Photo Editor, using it mainly for cropping, color, brightness, and contrast balancing, and sharpening and softening.
Bummer! Sure looks like it is the particular version of Winders you have.
I just tried several experiments using MS Paint in standard vanilla Windows 7… created a canvas of 800x600 and drew a 300x300 square in it. I then rotated the whole canvas, selected just the square and rotated it, selected a large 350x600 area that included the square and rotated it… the square remained 300x300 the whole time.
I am pleased to know that mine does not screw it up, but I have no immediate knowledge of what you can do to fix the problem on your PC. Having to adjust the aspect ratio every time you rotate an image is surely a pain. Hope you don’t have to do it often!
Since it does it on your PC using multiple programs, it sure seems to be something that is reading the aspect ratio of your screen and getting it wrong because of the Hebrew and Arabic enabling.
I suppose it might be associated with the interpretation of the sub level of Pixels, known as TWIPS. Most recent (ha! within the last 10 to 15 years!) PCs that I have worked with use 15 TWIPS per Pixel in both the X and Y directions. I do know I have seen some that had different numbers for each X and Y. I suppose that the Hebrew and Arabic enabling has altered them without regard for what it really are. But, again, I don’t know what you can do about it, if anything even can be done about it.