In the old days engine crews and conductors had to have a pocket watch meeting certain style and accuracy standards. Are modern railroad workers still required to wear a special watch? I have seen Seiko and Citizen wristwatches in stores with an easily read white dial marked “railroad approved” and was wondering if these are mandatory nowadays.
Still required to carry an accurate watch, although we no longer run on a timetable or a timed schedule.
Haven’t had my watch card checked in years.
Those watches that say railroad approved have not necessarily been “approved” by any railroad, although most roads like it when you have both a 12 hour and a 24 watch face, as we still work on the 24 hour, or military clock.
My railroad requires you to carry a watch capable of both, with Arabic numbers (no Roman numerals) and our watch is required to be set with-in 30 seconds of our “standard” clock, which in turn is set to the same time as the Naval Observatory.
Ed
Not only engineers and conductors had to have a rr approved watch but hostlers, brakemen, switchmen,road foremen, signal maintainers, and operating officials.
Mitch
…And now the accuracy of watches has taken a new turn recently…Watches now, {many of them available}, are corrected several times a day {by radio}, from Colorado and are always accurate to the fraction of a second…I have a clock in our house as such and my wristwatch is of that kind too and you can walk up to check both together anytime and the seconds are flipping over at precicely the same time…Always.
Most railroad employee timetables include a list of approved watches that meet fairly stiff accuracy and reliability standards. I do have some timetables from the late 1960’s and early 1970’s that included certain models of the Bulova Accutron as approved so the watch does not have to be a large mechanical pocket watch.
My Seiko wristwatch, purchased 1981 still runs just fine and says “Railroad Approved” on the bottom face and is still maintained by George Schacterle, the ATSF/BNSF timekeeper in La Junta. Ed and Atmark are correct in their assertions. Will add that trackmen, signal maintainers and anyone else who was out on the physical plant had to have reliable timepieces as well.
Timepieces are the most accurate and precise equipment known to man. Don’t know the difference between accuracy and precision? - You’ll never be a surveyor/mudchicken![:D]
[^][^][^]
Thanks for all the info. The modern quartz watches are no doubt more accurate than the old mechanical pocket watches but have alot less character. I have a small collection of old RR pocket watches from Elgin, Waltham, Hamilton, Ball and Illinois. If only they could talk…
I bought my Hamilton Railway Special, used, from Sam Linzur at Central Watch in Chicago in 1966. Since then it went through 3 years of high school, the CNW, Milwaukee Road, and South Shore Line in train and engine service. It survived a deadly head-on train wreck where my chain that it was anchored to didn’t. I looked at it the moment my son was born in '98. When I look at that watch’s dial I see the times of my life. It still runs accurately and I do have to adjust it from time to time. I have a Ball Trainmaster wrist watch, and Accutron as well. Even the rr wrist watches from the sixties have a great deal of character to them.
Railroad wrist watches were first introduced on the P&LE RR in '61. It was believed that railroaders were not always going to have watch pockets on their trousers and wouldn’t always be wearing vests. There was also the problem of railroaders wearing both their regulation pocket watch, but in addition wearing a non-standard wrist watch for ready referrence. There’s a rule in the rule book that states one may not wear a non-standard watch when on duty with a standard watch.
Mitch
…One would think the system would update the regulation to conform to modern watches that do not have to be set manually {ever}, as they are automatically set by radio from the government time mechicanism in Boulder, Colorado. And even if that adjustment ability would ever screw up…its’ still a quartz watch that’s correct to a few seconds a month…
I saw an empty watch box just yesterday in the crew lounge of the motel where rail crews stay. One of the crew members must have gotten a new wrist watch. This included a stop watch, useful, and an alarm clock, also useful. I am sure it was digtal with day and date as well as the time in hours, minutes and seconds in arabic numerals. It probably has a back light function so you do not have to mess with your lantern to get the time for the delay report. The price sticker was still on the box…$6.43. My how times have changed.
There is a story about the early quartz watches. They had a high failure rate in the crystals and thus the price was high. The defective crystals were sold for scrap since they were useless for timekeeping. Suddenly, Citizen Watch Co was selling very cheap but very accurate quartz watches. They had figured out that all those inaccurate quartz time pieces could be made accurate by soldering a small capacitor across the leads for pennies. This from an old Business School case study.
I was surprised to notice recently that some big-box retailers (notably Wal-Mart and Shopko) carry RR-style watches.
Don’t know if these pocket models are in accord with today’s standards, but with even five-dollar watches containing Japanese movements, they may be accurate enuf.
The Wal-Mart watches came in silvertone and goldtone with a heavy chain and cost about $6.97. The one from Shopko was marked down from the high twenties to $14.99 and is a very handsome model with a smaller pocket watch and a gentleman’s penknife to match. That penknife and watch bear identical pictures; the effect is of stenciling on an opalescent or mother-of-pearl background 'tho at these prices I assume they are some sort of plastic or new-generation ceramic.
The tradition still sings — tho’ sometimes it’s nostalgia keeps the tune going.
allen
I’ve always wondered about having a modern, inexpensive quartz-style movement put into a size 16 case that’s gold filled with an accurate reproduction of a real railroad watch dial. It could be a little pricy but it would be accurate in many directions.
Mitch
Best of both worlds; go for it Mitch!
But these days it isn’t very easy to find a REAL jeweler or watchsmith…
There are some around, but he advantage of what I prposed would be that you wouldn’t need a jeweler. It would be a simple movement a la Citizens in a beefed up and beautiful case and dial. If the movement went bad order you could easily take the hands and dial off and pop in a new one.
Beauty and simplicity combined with accuracy. The case would be weighted so the thing weighed the same as a railroad pocket watch so the thing felt like something. No cheap stampings of a puffing-billy locomotive, just a real-looking railroad pocket watch that reflects today’s technology.
Nice looking repro dials and hands are still made in Switzerland. I’m sure a casemaker could be found. Just plop in a quartz and ya have it. Whatcha say?
Mitch
Our Railroad calls for a reliable, accurate watch. A supervisor objected to one engineer having a official Mickey Mouse watch, and took the Engineer out of service.
The Union and Arbitrator proved to railroad that the Mickey Mouse watch was accurate and did have a second hand.
[quote]
QUOTE: Originally posted by artmark
Just as long as you could unscrew the back and watch the wheels and gears move. The inside needs to be jeweled as well. It should come with two hour hands, one in blue to match the minute hand and one in red to signify the second time zone you are working in, just like the Hamilton’s used to.
[quote]
QUOTE: Originally posted by arbfbe
A jeweler friend of mine, who is in the antique watch busines, once costed out what the retail price would be of a new Hamilton railroad pocket watch would be in today’s dollars. It came out to about $2,500.00. That included the 21 jewels. That’s just what I’m trying to avoid in this proposal. It would be neat but too expensive. Especially when you have to ship it off to a specialist for repairs.
Not all Hamilton RR pocket watches came with the dual hour hand. In fact it was rare. That was known as a “Fort Wayne Hour Hand.” So named because the Pennsy, and NYC, operating from Eastern to Central time zones felt the need to have watches reflect the two zones. As Fort Wayne was a division point where men went west towards Chicago and the Central time zone, this feature was given this unofficial monicur.
Mitch
As long as the watch has a second hand, it can be used on the job. I have a $5.oo Wal Mart that I have had for three yrs and when it takes a crap, I’ll go buy anothr one.
Well I guess I will have to buy a watch after all when I get hired out. Ever since I had a cell phone I’ve been useing that clock but, that’s not going to be acceptable on the railroad I guess.
May great grandfather who worked for PRR had a railroad pocket watch that was given to him by PRR. Unfortunitly, he gave it away to his son’s my deceased great Uncle Frank’s ex wife’s dad. Oh boy was that a ever a big mistake.
Mitch,
My post was a bit tongue in cheek. I remember my father leting me see the open back of his Hamilton when I was very little. It still fascinates me when I look into the back of my own.
I am on my third Sieko-mickey since 1977 and none have had the action stop. I forget why the first one went b/o but the last one had the face come loose inside the crown. You could rotate your wrist and make it any time you wanted it to be. I would cost more to fix than replace. So the basic Sieko mechanism inside a nice machined metal case with a ceramic or glazed face could be a good seller and reasonably priced. I would rather buy one of those than the gaudy pocket watches offerred now. Even a couple of hundred $$ for quality, more of a gold case, I am sure. I will miss those movement actions under the back cover, though.
I know the Hamilton’s did not come with the extra hand but most jewelers who sold them here in Montana would install them when they sold the watch. I have not been able to find a source for the parts for some time now. I could use a couple for the Hamilton’s I own.