I have a logging branch on my DCC layout that I am getting ready to make operational. I got a DC Rivarossi Heisler many years ago for the purpose of working this branch. This Heisler will be the only loco working the branch so the thought hit me that it would probably be cheaper if I just wired the branch to run DC rather than buy and install a decoder in the Heisler. I would have to have an interchange section of the layout that could operate in DC or DCC mode. My thought is to have a switch that would flip the bus line on that section between the two different power sources. Since I am a lone wolf operator, at no time would I need to be running both DC and DCC locos in this interchange section simultaneously. I’m not the sharpest guy when it comes to electronics but it seems to me this would work. Does anybody see a downside to this? Would a double pole/double throw switch be what I would want for this?
From a previous layout I have a DC power pack and a tethered throttle that is long enough to reach both ends of the logging branch so I wouldn’t need to invest in those.
Second Mel’s suggestion for a center off DPDT, insures that section is dead until you make a decision which one you want. Other wise the section is always live in one mode or the other and that could cause problems
When we went to DCC, we tried some blocks in DC and some in DCC. Our DC hand made throttles were good for about 2.5 amps. We use to double or triple diesels.
One time someone crossed and we were all gabbing. Smoked the NCE Power Pro Booster. After that, DC at home.
I’ve heard yet more horror stories of “bridging the gap” both with programming tracks and/or DC/DCC combined sections. You really need to have an isolated section as long as the locomotive and be sure of the [electrical] switch settings before crossing over the isolated section.
I agree with Ed “bridging the gap” so I drew up a simple fix for someone that would like to do what the OP ask to do.
By using a 4PDT toggle one can easily install an isolated section of track to prevent a mishap by an engine crossing a gap between the DC and the DCC operations.
Click to enlarge
The Isolated section could be the length of a locomotive and protect both systems. The Isolated section would be dead (no power) in the DC position.
I do agree with Ed, he has many tracks, and trains on the layout at once. Any thing could happen.
I’m like the OP, just me running trains, and I can run both, but never at the same time, and 2 engines with trains on the layout at once is rare. I might run a continous main line train, while switching with another, but that is a rare occasion.
Thank you Mel, for showing a way that those of do this, can add some saftey and isolation to what we do.
I like the OP’s idea, with his ops., but I haven’t looked, as Ed has, as to the install of a decoder in the OP’s loco.
I use DC for my complete main line, to test locos for DCC conversions. Test over, DC unpluged, disconected from the track, and DCC back on.
Would it be possible to have a secion of track, twice the length of a Loco that is gaped and never powered. Back cars into this section, pull away, back other engine in from the other end, couple and pull away?
I installed decoders in two of these engines. The most complicated part is removing the body (there is a hidden screw under the water cap in the back). No need to change the motor - just make sure the decoder is rated at 1 amp stall. You won’t regret it - it will give you way more flexibility on the layout if both sections are connected.
I am going to suggest you use a 4PDT toggle. These can be found on eBay for about 10.00.
Wire a DPDT section of the switch so that it switches the transition track.
Then, isloate a 12" section of track on either side of the transition track and wire each with one rail through a section of the 4PDT switch so when the transition track is DCC, the DC section is unpowered, and when the transition track is DC, the DCC section leading to it is unpowered.
I don’t think that will work. The logging branch has several switch backs and will take its loads to the interchange yard. It will end up doing a runaround as will the loco making the pickups and setouts. Having a dead section of track would be too limiting.
OK, if I decide to go with a switchable DC/DCC set up, I understand the dangers if a DCC loco bridges the gap into the section that has been switched to DC. If I have a DCC loco stationary in the switchable section and I then flip the switch to DC, is that going to cause problems or is it only when it passes from a DCC section to a DC section?
I still haven’t made a final decision. One reason I am reluctant to install a decoder is my soldering skills are not the best and anytime I go under the hood on a loco there is a real possibility of my ham hands doing some real damage. In another thread I told of a problem I had with a Bachmann Consolidation. I was forced to open up the tender. I thought I had taken care of the problem but in reassembling it, I broke one of the tiny recepticles off the tender that the loco plugs into. I’ll probably have to send it back to the manufacturer now to get it repaired. If I ordered a replacement part, I’d still have to solder some very tiny wires onto the terminals of that part. Way beyond my skill level.
Has long has that switchable section of track is off, no problem.
If your going to change to DC ops, why even have a DCC loco on that track? Keep it on the DCC track, or remove it from the layout.
If you move the DCC loco on to the powered DC track, problems!
Isn’t there a "drop in " decoder for your loco? Have you checked decoder sites like TCS? or even Digitrax?
Is your loco a Spectrum consolidated?
I just looked at Ed’s link to the TCS install of a decoder in your Heisler, it doesn’t get any easier! The decoder plugs in. It probably takes longer to open up the loco than it does to install the decoder.
A decoder might cost $20. Messing up and crossing the gaps with both Dc and DCC enabled will cause a lot more than $20 in damage.
Switches, deasd track sections, or completel disconnects will avoid the problem of damaging something, but it’s just as easy to install a decoder in the one loco that doesn’t have one than make all these changes just to support said loco.
The logging branch interchanges with the mainline so there has to be a section where both the DC and DCC locomotives can operate although not at the same time. Having a dead section of track is not and option since runaround moves will be involved in the interchange.
The Heisler is an older Rivarossi. They now make that same loco with factory installed decoders or at least DCC ready (plug in decoder option). Mine will require some soldering. I’ve never been good at soldering and I’ve had lots of practice. It’s one thing to solder a feeder wire to a section of track. It’s quite another when it involves sensitive electronics. It’s a skill I’ve just never gotten the hang of and I avoid it whenever I can. Kind of like an air brush. I never learned to use one of those either.
There’s no need to solder directly to the electronics of the decoder. You need one with wires, ni plug ont he end. These are actually the most inexpensive types of decoders. You solder wires (small, but still wires) to wires, not to the electronics. At least for the track input power, the motor output power, and lights front and rear.
A full size one might not fit, but they can also be had with a 9 pin plug. As such, you can set the electronic bit aside while soldering the wires, then plug it in. The TCS MC series have disconnectable plugs and are much smaller. The MC2 has a 7 pin plug and socket. You unplug the wiring harness while connecting it to the loco wiring, and then plug the decoder in after it’s all done.
As it’s the older model, it probably has incandescent bulbs for the headlight. You would probably want to replace those with LEDs and resistors, because the hot light bulb will possibly melt the plastic around the headlight housing. That’s the most complicated part of the whole thing.
OK, thanks, I get what your saying about the Heisler. I don’t understand not having a place for a “dead” track, that can switched either way, gets in the way of a runaround move? You can’t do a runaround move using both DC and DCC at the same time.
Maybe it would help if you could show a track diagram of what your doing.
Going either way with DCC and DC is very doable, but both can’t be operating at the same time, UNLESS the DC has seperate power supply, and NO WAY is connected to the DCC power.
The idea is fine. each needs it’s own isolated power supply.
My thoughts are, to do this hobby and make things work takes development of some skills. Soldering is at the top of the list.
I guess I’m not totally understanding the situation. A track plan would help.
