Why is it that HO gauge model railroad trains look more realistic than O gauge and larger scales? I have always found HO gauge to look considerably more realistic than their larger counterparts. One would think that a larger model would produce more opportunity for detail and realism.
I know I will be accused of posting this on the wrong forum, but (1) the people I talk to are on this forum and (2) I am more interested in the lay opinion.
Gabe
I would have to agree with you there. I don’t know why either, but ‘N’ scale seems to look too small (the rails look huge under those little locos). ‘O’ scale seems to big and toy-like (and its pricey). HO looks just about right. Maybe I am biased, I don’t know.
I can agree with you there. But once you get up to 1/8 scale, things start to look very realistic.
Gabe: The O and O27 train equipment as manufactured by Lionel, I would say, could be called simply representationally accurate. HO at 1/8 scale is delivered by manufacturers who actually are creating ‘scale’ models. Just my view! ‘O Scale’ is much more diamentionally accurate in the car bodies than the regular tinplate as was delivered by Lionel
This is probably the verbal equivalent of throwing a fresh fish into a pack of hungry cats!![2c]
[%-)]
What I ment was 1.5 inch scale, which runs on a track guage of 7.5 inches. Yes you can ride on them. They are about the closest I can get to owning a real train![:)]
Part of it is because HO is still the most popular scale, and the money is in that…so the detail is added to keep the customer buying.
The larger scales, O and such, do have a lot of detail, but the cost to make them as realistic as something in HO would drive the cost to the consumer up so much there would be no market.
You can buy brass O scale, with excellent detail, but you better have a big checkbook.
HO is just small enough to let you have a “lot” of model train and track, but big enough that the cost of detail isn’t too prohibitive.
N scale is getting there, but is small enough that most wouldn’t even notice the additional detail, and adding it would be expensive.
The tin plate crowd like it just the way it is…not much to scale, or heavy on prototype detail.
I model in HO, because there is so much available, and I scratch build locomotives in that scale because there are enough after market details that I can built almost anything to prototype.
Ed
cost…
the highly detailed O scale steamers I’ve seen are priced like $1,800.00 +
Not too many would sell at that price.
Highly detailed HO scale, the engines are what? $400.00+?
Plus, at the smaller scale, fine detail is not near as sharp as it has to be at the larger scales.
In Illustration: a pneumatic coupling at HO scale can be a bump, but once you get up to O scale, then the experienced eye starts looking for more familiar features on said coupling, and extra features= cost
…Marx, American Flyer and Lionel brought “electric trains” to the populace back in the depression era…No detail of scale was provided at the prices these “train sets” were sold for.
O and O27 were the widely accepted size that were sold in sets and their designs evolved a little as we went through WWII and out the other side to eventually we got into an economy that could produce HO size and scale and of course N scale later on…
Pre WWII, some “train sets” were sold for less than 10 dollars…! As someone above mentioned…Money…Absolutely…!
PS: One more comment…Some of you may have seen OMI advertised in various publications…They sold very expensive brass units from the far east, etc…and very much scale and detailed…The Co. was right here in Muncie. Used to talk to him {Mr. Marsh}, occasonally.
I think S scale – the stuff from River Raisin, American Models and S-Helper Service (Showcase Line) looks every bit as realistic as HO – and the SN3 stuff is even better.
Agree with you there. The only thing is that to run a good s scale layout you really have to be a master craftsman at the hobby - not much stuff is available commercially. Supposedly more s scale stuff is available today than years past, but it still has to be one of the most challenging (and probably rewarding) scales to model in.
Greetings,
I would have to have say that HO is probably the best looking stuff right now as far as detail. However being an N-scale modeler, N-scale is getting there but with the small size some details wouldn’t even be noticed. However with N-scale one can run long trains of hoppers or whatever with 3-4 locomotives and the train doesn’t seem overly long. Trains that long in HO just don’t look right.
Keith
A lot of people don’t realize that O scale and O gauge don’t match up correctly…and that’s part of the problem. When Marklin came out with O gauge (actually “zero” not the letter “O”, since their other gauges were No.1, No.2 and No.3 gauge) track, they made it 1-1/4" wide. For that to scale out to be 4’ 8-1/2" standard gauge, the correct scale model train would be built to a ratio of 1:43.5. In the US, we chose to build to 1:48 scale, allowing an easier conversion of 1/4" = 1 foot. BUT this means that in the US 1-1/4" O gauge track scales out to 5 scale feet across.
Because of this, most all US O scale models - no matter how well made and detailed - are fundamentally flawed in appearance.
(BTW the 1:43.5 scale ratio is why HO (“Half O”) is 1:87 scale.)
I think a lot of it is just illusion. In HO, just having a semblance of the detail gives the illusion that it is more detailed than it really is.
In O, because it is so much bigger, you expect to see the detail, not just a semblance of it.
The brain playing tricks on you (and me), that is what I think.
“I know I will be accused of posting this on the wrong forum,”
That’s right, you are over here on a prototype forum as though you are hiding under your mama’s dress, peeking out and instigating a cat fight.
However, in the interest of defending my chosen scale, I am going to strongly disagree with you and everyone here that does agree with you. Take a look, and it doesn’t have to be a close look, at the detail of some of todays O scale offerings and HO just doesn’t compare. Of course there are various levels of detail in each scale and O can hold it’s own.
I’ll see you on the other side of the 'hood when you want to come throwing stones.[;)]
O scale trolleys are second to none . HO scale cannot do justice to traction models.
I must agree HO is still pretty true to scale, but I did see a blue O gauge brass locomotive(with sound) that was absolutely stunning and as detailed as an HO locomotive, but was only available for a major body part or your 3rd born son.
What exactly is “S” scale? Is that the stuff they call “garden” model roads? somewhere around 1/18 scale?
I think you have answered Gabe’s question better than anyone else here.
Economics.
The cost required to make a larger scale train appear highly detailed, drives the price beyond what the mainstream consumer is able to spend.
Sure it can be done, but once they were built would they sell enough to make staying in business an attractive proposition?
Take a look at some of today’s two rail O scale high-end brass models from the likes of Kohs. Spend a few minutes looking at their website, and you’ll wonder how you ever put up with those HO toys. For the lesser budgets, take a look at the brass from Third Rail, as well as Zamac(die cast) from Lionel and MTH and plastic from Atlas O. Most of the Zamac models and even some plastic models have separate brass details.
Of course, a lot of this doesn’t come cheap, but Lionel, MTH and Atlas turn out some really nice plastic freight cars at prices in the neighborhood of $50 each.
Three rail O scale has made some great strides in the last few years at making really great models that are very affordable. Two rail O scale has always existed, and is growing even bigger and less expensive than it traditionally was.
Finally, there’s a small segment called “Proto 48” that lay their rails to the proper scale width for 1/4" scale and scratch build all of their models. Most of them have some amazing layouts.
By the way, to answer an earlier question, S scale is 1/64, which is somewhere between HO and O scale. Probably the most popular maker was AC Gilbert, which made toy trains that competed directly with Lionel in the 1950s and '60s. It’s been gaining popularity in recent years.
I can’t usually answer modeling questions with authority, but this one I can:
S scale is 1/64, or 3/16" to the foot. It is between O and HO in size, and originally was another of those “Electric Train” scales, courtesy of A. C. Gilbert and his American Flyer line.
Think about it this way: O scale is one third larger in size than S scale. It probably takes 1/3 more brass in each of the three dimensions–so you’re talking 4/3 x 4/3 x 4/3 = 64/27, or nearly 2.5 times as much material. You might get away with a thumb or your third-born-son’s pet.