From the Altoona Mirror
http://www.altoonamirror.com/News/articles.asp?articleID=7839
Dave
Steamtown’s shops are very much like a garage I used to take my mom’s VW to. Those bozos would have that piece of [censored] for up to three weeks for a simple repair. A complicated one? [xx(]fuhgedaboudit![banghead]
We aren’t likely to see B&M 3713 running in this decade, or on the decade after that, either. [banghead]
The article was very good. As long as the taxpayers of PA can afford it, l think Bill Frederick was the man for the job. The K-4 deserves the best.
It’s idiotic statements like this one, with a lame attempt to criticize the Park Service or Steamtown NHS, that proves the poster didn’t read the article. It’s so full of total misinformation:
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Steamtown and the National Park Service, do not own, and are NOT the people/organization responsible for restoring the K-4. If some Bozos would take the time to read the linked article, they’d see that the locomotive belongs to and is being restored under the control of the Railroader’s Memorial Museum in Altoona, which explains why the article is from an Altoona newspaper.
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The statment also shows that the poster has no experience in historic restoration work, and probably would hurt himself if he tried to use a screwdriver. Power tools??? Fuhgedaboudit.
Now for the final couple questions: How much time have you devoted to ANY restoration work? How much have you contributed toward that type work?
It’s easy to sit back and shoot your (virtual) mouth off while contributing nothing to the effort.
Bill Fredrickson was a great guy, and a meticulous worker. The restoration job he was doing to the K4 would have yielded a locomotive the quality that rolled out of the Juniata Shops back in the days of steam. I was rather surprised to see this article, but I haven’t been up since before Thanksgiving.
The article hit the nail on the head, I was always disappointed that I couldn’t get up there more often to work with the crew. The crew was “sparce” to say the least.
Funny, they’re promising the new guy more people to get the work done. I’m still skeptical about the cold water boiler test in February. That seems more than a bit optomistic.
But then, this is the second time I know of that they’ve changed the leader on the K-4 project.
I’m just glad a Pennsy K-4 will be running again YES!!!
…Where will the 1361 be running when it is ready for the rails…?
I stand behind my opinion![^] Further, I provided funds to a number of restoration efforts, some of which worked out and some that did not. I cannot assist in restoration work, except financially.
There is another bone for you to spit back, why was 1361 sent so far away from the potential pool of volunteer labor to do the work?[:(!]
I fear that the people who made the money happen are feeling that the engine may never run “on-time”
I for one would want that engine as perfect in every part as we can make it before we steam it. Is this the engine that ran back in the late 80’s at York PA?
We must never push a engine to completion. This is not the late 40’s where hundreds of skilled workers were availible for heavy repairs with the engine pre-scheduled to depart on a train a few hours or days later.
Steam Engines are supposed to be tended to, restored and maintained by those who have the money, skills and the resources (Read: TIME)to do it properly. These are not machines that you can flip a dollar into a slot and hit a switch on a schedule.
What was the work that apparently needed to be “Re-done?”
Would you think that Mike Tilger will re-hire Bill Frederickson and allow the man to continue working on the engine? I suspect this will in a small way satisfy some of the apparent lack of “Bodies” on the site. Apparently PennDOT has stated that Bill’s work is that of a Craftsman and really we should have people stay on the job if they want the work done.
What pipes are they referring to in the article? Are we dealing with the boiler flues? If so why can we not test and replace the bad ones on site?
And one other thought. Altoona is the place that built these engines why is the engine somewhere else? Should it not be where there are facilities to do the work properly like it was on the day it was built long ago?
Im not worried about the money needed for the track, buildings etc.
I always get a good laugh out of things like this. It’s all promises promises…and the government is involved, as if the situation weren’t grave enough. This is steam, and that engine will run when it’s ready. Hurrying won’t solve anything.
I cannot wait until they have the K-4 under steam. It would be great to have as famous a locomotive as the K-4 only a few hours away whereas I could go ride behind it.
But despite that…This project mustn’t be rushed. A steam locomotive is one of the most meticulous engines designed, and must be held to very high tolerances in order to work most proper. These things must be carefully engineered for best performance; which will not come from speeding up the restoration time schedule.
[quote user=“PBenham”]
I stand behind my opinion![^] Further, I provided funds to a number of restoration efforts, some of which worked out and some that did not. I cannot assist in restoration work, except financially.
There is another bone for you to spit back, why was 1361 sent so far away from the potential pool of volunteer labor to do the work?[:(!]
The work that needed to be redone was, in a small part, a difference in craftsmanship between Jeff and Bill, but the largest change was the new boiler regulations passed after the Gettysburg incident, these caused a lot of things to be looked at more closely.
It would be hard to predict if the offer would come or if Bill would accept it, the safest thing to say is that I can’t speak for him.
The pipes being refered to in the article can’t be the boiler tubes, these are all going to be replaced with new tubes, which I believe are already at Scranton. They could possibly be talking about the superheater bundles, we found a LOT of them bad.
True, the Juniata Shops in Altoona would be a great place to restore steam locomotives, but the current shops are a shadow of what they used to be as far as size, and were long ago converted to heavy maintenance of the diesel locomotives. Plus, I don’t think Norfolk Southern has much interest in having a new steam program.
Don’t count on seeing the K4 on Horseshoe Curve, I doubt Norfolk Southern would allow that. What I know of that part of the arrangements is strictly word of mouth, so take it for what it’s worth. Supposedly, the K4 would run out of Scranton for a time, as “payment” for use of the shop facilities, and to allow a shakedown run near the shops. The most often suggested running track for the K4 after it moves back to Altoona is the Nittnay and Bald Eagle, but no details on the accuracy of either of these suggestions.
here here
Solid Cast Drivers?
UGH. That has to be a one-off experiment.
I read the .pdf that was issued by the Transportation Board responsible for the Gettysburg Incident some time ago. I remember two things:
The bolts in the boiler that failed were designed to fail in that manner as a design feature.
The water gauge was no good in the cab partly because maybe the crew did not recieve the maintaince support to keep that in working order for the grade.
There should always have been water in the boiler and for that short of a run, there is no excuse for allowing the water to drop that low as it did.
I rode the Gettysburg Steam Train a few times in my life and distinctly recall my last ride with her approx a year or so before the incident. Heading back to Gettysburg from what I recall as “Highfield” she was “Walking” a little bit side to side working hard (Running tender first) for a time with bits of steam leaking here and there. Perhaps the consist was rather heavy that day I dont know. I always thought of that engine as a bit wee light for the work she was doing in that part of the country. Strasburg’s #90 (Decapod) would have done the task well.
Steam engines demand the best we can provide.
I dont know anything about the “Political” side of parent railroads like the NS who may or may not allow steam to run on rails that might be under one railroad’s ownership. I see it as a potentially messy area.
What we need to have is one place in this Nation (Or several) where steam can run (Other than Union Pacific… no offense) unfettered and free on rails that are not grown over or sunken into the earth. (Or worse too light or badly maintianed for lack of funds)
We do have good steam at the tourist railroads. I enjoy riding them and I spend freely at the gift shop. My hat is off the the volunteers like Tom. Thanks
[quote user=“TomDiehl”]
[quote user=“PBenham”]
I stand behind my opinion![^] Further, I provided funds to a number of restoration efforts, some of which worked out and some that did not. I cannot assist in restoration work, except financially.
There is another bone for you to spit back, why was 1361 sent so far away from the potential pool of volunteer labor to do the work?
I was at Steamtown recently and saw the K4. Not a pretty sight, you can’t even recognise it. They do explain what has been going on though. Steamtown has impressive shops but it would be nice to see more steamers restored.
You’re forming an opinion that is not based on fact. You can’t blame Steamtown because other organizations don’t have the money or personnel to restore their engines. It’s not Steamtown’s problem that the group restoring 3713 doesn’t have the money or qualified persons to restore it on your personal timeline.
And a message to the Government naysayers: if it weren’t for funds provided by Pennsylvania, the K4 would not be restored. Plain and simple.