As the title asks what is the difference. I found them on ebay and they look the same. They are made by stewart. Is stewart any good? Do they use traction tires? I amm trying to stay away from traction tires.
Mike
In the title, those are all Baldwin Locomotive Works designations for their diesels. The numerical part of VO-1000 and VO-660 are horsepower ratings, the “VO” is the engine type. The last one is very descriptive if you know the code. DS (diesel switcher) 4-4 (2 trucks, total 4 axles, all powered) 1000 (horsepower).
I understand the Stewart brand is pretty good, but since I don’t have any, I can’t answer from experience, or the traction tire question.
Thanks tom. I looked them up on railpics.net and could not tell any difference between them.
Does anyone know if these are two truck driven?
Yes they are. Way back (1980’s) Stewart used Athearn drives, then switched to Kato smooth running drives in the 90’s, and in recent years have used their own. They’re very good runners, very good at slow speed operating. I’d maybe rate them second to Atlas but a very close second.
The earliest VO diesel switchers had a big oval screen opening on the nose. After that changed, the later Baldwin switcher models were pretty similar. There are subtle differences between the three switchers you mention…kind of like comparing a 1998 car to a 2007 version of the same car. Same basic idea, but some improvements/changes over time.
thanks for the info
The Baldwin Switchers are all Ajin powered (the builder of Overlannd’s Diesels) and are very good runners. If you need any further information on the diesel types go to the Bowser-Stewart website and see the spotting differences on all the Baldwin Switchers.
Here is the link:
http://www.bowser-trains.com/Stewart/Stewart%20Switcher%20Chart.htm
Rick
The VO series Baldwins were the “original” series of switchers offered by Baldwin. they cam in several engine sizes and a few variations. VO-660 (660 hp) was shorter than the VO-1000 (1000 hp) due to different engine sizes. At some point Baldwin changed its naming convention for its models (sorta like when GE went from a U30C to a C30-7). DS is diesel switcher, 4-4 means 4 axles all powered, 1000 is the hp. So a VO-1000 became a DS-4-4-1000. When the names changed they also changed styling and details, so there will be differences in grills, vents, fairings, etc. They do look alike, but not exactly alike.
Stewart switchers are excellent. They are all wheel drive and pickup, no traction tires and very smooth running. I have both the VO-660 and VO-1000 in HO.
Dave H.
Stewarts are not just “pretty good”, they are top-notch runners. The Buehler and Cannon drives are second to none. Excellent at low speed response. And, boy, can they pull. Neither my VO-660 or my FT has traction tires.
Mike, as mentioned, they are all switchers that look very similar. The difference is mostly under the hood…
Tom
I just bid on a vo-1000 and am looking at bidding on a as-616. They come with everything including lenses. I worried about this because I have seen some with out already built on ebay.
Thanks for everyones help.
I agree 100%
The VO-1000 was commonly used in steel plants.
Stewarts use EXCELLENT German can motors and drive. Their drive is flawless right out of the box, and creeps along.
Unfortunately, the engines lack the detail level of other companies. With some detail kits they sell, and work you can dress up the steam engines. Not so much on the diesels however.
BTW: I have a pair VO-1000 drives (both standard DC and DCC Loksound) and I think they are great lil engines.
The loksound version looses a good bit of weight to place a speaker inside the chasis. Also the loksound version doesn’t “notch-up” So I’m guessing the VO-1000 engine just ran at one speed and traction motor power was throttled via rheostat. Does anybody know this for sure?
The stewart switchers are great runners and detail on the newer offerings is equal to or better than some of the higher priced units on the market. I just built 2 new DS4-4-1000 and a VO660 and an S-8. Hand rails are good and even have wipers and train line hoses. Put a TCS MC2 with BEMF and you have a great switcher that will last for years.
Pete
As for the prototype switchers, there were slight differences in the hood/frame length, depending on the size of the prime mover. I don’t have my references available right now, but in general, the 1000 hp locomotives (VO-1000 and early DS-4-4-1000) had eight-cylinder engines and longer hoods, while the 660 hp locos (VO-660 and DS-4-4-660) had six cylinder engines and shorter hoods/frames. Later, Baldwin put a supercharged six cylinder engine that developed 1000 hp under the shorter hood and sold this their DS-4-4-1000.
Moving over to the Stewart models. I own a VO-1000, and it is a great engine. Don’t hesitate to buy one (or any of their switcher models). However, you also mentioned an interest in the AS-616. I own one of the early versions of this, and I have mixed feelings about it. Mine has the Athearn-type drive which is fine, but not on the same level as their Ajin drive models. But, the stewart-built three-axle trucks have caused me some trouble, and I would definitely hesitate before buying another one. I understand that Stewart/Bowser has re-released the AS-16 with an Ajin drive, but I am not sure whether later releases of the AS-616 have an improved drive/trucks or not. Before you bid, ask for photos of the mechanism so you know what you’re getting for sure.
Good Luck,
Tom
DIFFERENCES are minor variations of typical early Diesels, and the smoothest, best runners I own - ideal for switching.
Stewart used multiple sources for drives. My VO1000’s were built by Ajin. All were good, but I’d inquire which chassis was used if you want to MU. Different motors may have different speed curves.
No tires or shortcuts. dehusman ‘nailed’ it. Stewart products are the best, most trouble-free runners I have. Some final assembly was needed (windows. stacks, railings, etc.) which may account for some parts lacking on 2nd hand purchases.
The early DS-4-4-660 and DS-4-4-1000 switchers look the same as the late model VO-1000s and VO-660s except that the early DSs have flat radiator grilles as opposed to the curved type found on the VOs. Stewart does not make models of the early DS-4-4-1000 or any of the variations of the DS-4-4-660.
I have models of the VO-1000, VO-660, DS-4-4-1000, and S-8. The shells are made by Ajin Precision of Korea and the drives are made by Stewart. They all have Canon flat can type motors in them and run quite well.
I also have an AS-616, and it has the newer motor and drive train. It runs just as good as an Atlas RS-3. The only thing I don’t like is the curvature of the cab roof. It looks flat and squared off compared to the switchers.
Baldwin diesels had air throttles as standard, and VO-1000s most certainly could be heard to notch up. So I’ll take a wild guess and say the LokSound decoder is the problem.
Mark.
Thanks for all the replys. I hope I win this one.
There are three books which are invaluable when researching diesels produced before 1989. They are “The Diesel Spotters Guide” , “The Second Diesel Spotters Guide” and “The Contemporary Diesels Spotters Guide”. They were written by “Louis Marre” and “Jerry Pinkepank”. They were (are?) available from Kalmbach Publishing. You may also find them from one of the railroad book dealers in Model Railroader or Railroad Model Craftsman or on the web. They contain spotting features production dates engine and horsepower specs and in some cases the railroads that originally purchased the units. Great books.
For the record, the “steel plant” moniker is for units given a second life. Many class 1 railroads purchased VO1000’s. The breakdown:
| Railroad | Quantity |
|---|---|
| Baldwin Locomotive Works (demonstrators) | 4 |
| American Steel and Wire Company | 1 |
| Atchison, Topeka and Santa Fe Railway | 59 |
| Atlantic Coast Line Railroad | 9 |
| Baltimore and Ohio Railroad | 25 |
Here are some links that also have a breakdown of who bought them. They also go deeper and say which phase, road number, how many exhaust stacks, etc. for those that want/need that level of detail.
VO-1000 roster:
http://users.inna.net/~jaydeet/vo-1000.htm
VO-660 roster:
http://users.inna.net/~jaydeet/vo-660.htm
DS 4-4-1000 roster:
http://users.inna.net/~jaydeet/ds4410.htm
I have found these incredibly useful when assembling (and numbering where necessary) Stewart switchers.
Matt
The Baldwin Loksounds do throttle up, however as the real engines are low speed diesels, you can’t really hear such effects as on other mid- or high-speed engines.
You can hear the samples on the ESU website http://www.esu.eu/index.php?id=339 or an isolated engine start-up/throttling up & down/shutdown sequence based on the ESU samples here : http://membres.lycos.fr/ramcas/sons_loksound/ESU_Baldwin_VO.mp3 .