I know this is going to sound crazy and perhaps ruffle some feathers to even suggest this on a railfan forum, but I just had to mention it and here’s why. It has come to my attention that a German firm called DLM (damplocomotive und maschienenfabrik) I think that’s the correct spelling is manufacturing brand, spanking new steam locomotives! They’re being sold to little Swiss cog and rack railways which haul a lot of tourists, but the website www.dlm-ag.ch has some good data comparing the matinence and operating costs of their new or retrofitted steam locomotives to old steam and diesel-electric and “new” steam comes out the cheapest (well according to the company anyways). I suppose if it works for such little operations in Switzerland, then why wouldn’t it work for Union Pacific or a real railroad company? They’re also making new reciprocating steam marine engines which I thought was kewl, but before anyone tars and feathers me, just check out the website for yourself and then share your thoughts.
I had gotten to that site through the Ultimate Steam Page. I gather they are fueled by “light oil” (i.e. #2 Diesel) rather than the Bunker C of the old oil burners, and the main application is tourist railroads, everything from those cog lines to a revival of the Orient Express. I heard they pay attention to thermal efficiency – modern exhaust systems, boiler thermal insulation, lagging on the cylinders to keep the steam in them hot, but burning Diesel fuel a proper Diesel is going to come out ahead – the main reason is the “entertainment value.” A wider community than foamer railfans expects steam power on these lines.
I guess there was a time when everything from locomotives to earth-moving equipment was steam powered, and my momma always told me if I didn’t clean up my room she would have to take a “steam shovel” to it (when I tell that joke I modernize it and say “front-end loader.”)
But when the QE-II gets converted from a steam turbine powerplant to Diesel, I guess it is a distant dream for steam to come to the rails. And you homeowners and people who serve on church councils: would you rather deal with steam/hot water heat or a hot air system?
I still think the biggest drawback to steam is not the thermal efficiency issue but the maintenance – think boiler maintenance, boiler inspections, rod and running gear maintenance.
DLM is not a German but a Swiss firm and the Swiss cog and rack railway with “new” steam locomotives is the famous Brienz-Rothorn-Bahn (http://www.brienz-rothorn-bahn.ch/e.html)!
Greetings from Switzerland!
They also do conversion kits for coal fired locos
Paul Milenkovic is right, the maintenance expense is the killer. For example, French steam locomotives were very efficient in their use of steam but they spent a lot of time in the shop being maintained. When labor is cheap, the expense may be tolerable, but that isn’t the case today. Even North American steam, which spent a lot more time on the road creating gross ton-miles, required a lot more in running maintenance than a diesel-electric and few roads streamlined their maintenance operation to the extent of Norfolk & Western in the postwar period.
Does anybody here recall the ACE3000 experiment in the 1970s?
I dont read German too well, so i have no idea what the site is talking about, but i do like the pictures[;)]
…Of course the ACE3000 steam experiment…with 614…Go to Google and type in the ID and bring up a great drawing of the talked about “new” steam engine.
When was the very last full size steam locomotive built in America? I know the N&W built its last 0-8-0 in 1952 or 53, but the two 4-4-0s built for the 1969 golden spike centennial were the last ones I know of. Of course there are large amusement park locomotives that have been built more recently but I am talking full size. Maybe one or another of our own cog railroads?
Dave Nelson
Steam never went away, it just got less attention. China, India and several otehr contries still use good old Steam as a motive fleet.
The New and Improved Steam the germans are using allows for one man crews, less maintenence than before and increased operational abilities. In other words, they are almost on par with diesels, in all senses.
Give the germans 10 years and they’ll refine it to the point that steam will again outclass diesels.
Steam in India is pretty much gone in general service, diesels and electrics are just about everywhere. There may be some left in odd locations here and there.
Steam in China has for the most part pulled back to Manchuria since that’s where the coal mines are and diesels are beginning to make inroads even there.
My 2000 issue of Jane’s World Railways shows minimal steam in the rest of the world, not unlike steam in the United States in 1958-1959.
Baldwin completed an order of export steam locomotives for India in 1954. Keep in mind that India’s loading gauge is fairly generous.
Forget China,I’m moving to Switzerland[:D]!
I suppose that even with better thermal efficiency the matinence on the rods and running gear could be pretty bad. On the other hand I think SteamerFan in right that just given a matter of time steam will be ruling the rails again. Personally I’m a freshman Engineering Technology student and my own intuition tells me that electronics need to be integrated into the system to further boost fuel efficiency to the magic point where the savings on fuel are so great, that matinence costs won’t matter because the overall cost compared to diesel will be so low.
how about a brand new 4-6-2 Pacific capable of 100mph, it’s a dream thats almost complete here in the UK, just waiting for the boiler to be made by a german firm, Dampflokwerk Meiningen (Steam Locomotive Works Meiningen), a workshop of the Deutsche Bahn.
the loco is an A1 class pacific thats being made from sctatch, every part is brand new so it will be classed as “new rolling stock” so will be free from other preserved loco restrictions such as limiting it to 75mph, the line speed will be the limit, yes yes, for more info and a video of the wheel turning for the first time go to,
http://www.a1steam.com/
[:D]
If oil gives out, the coal and nuclear power will be used for electric cars and trains. I don’t see steam making a comeback except in specific situations, but then that may be enough to suite steam fans.
When you think about steaam coming back in America, consider how many [u]diesel locomotives it takes to sufficently power a modern freight train. Also take into consideration how much it would cost to build water towers, coaling towers and also the regular maitnence cost. It would be cool, but not a reality.
With diesel fuel climbing to all time highs, it’s likely that alternative modes of energy will be looked at and tried out, this is already taking place with the Green Goat hybrid switchers that are running off of batteries that are charged by a small diesel generator.
I was hearing that for the first time ever, diesel is taking the place of labour as the highest coast for railways, so you can bet that railways are going to be looking at alternatives.
Steam I find hard to imagine, however hybrid locomotives seem like a very likely candidate at the moment.
UT OH WATCH OUT!!! Steam is comming back with an attack!! Hay I wouldn’t mind seeing steam come back to into the everyday operations of Class One. Even though I grew up on diesel, love diesel, and am a diesel machinest… I need to see the Allegheny H8 2-6-6-6 run.
Don’t you mean the Swiss… They get a bit upset about this type of confusion… Almost as bad as a Canuck being mistaken for a Yank.
…If oil does become too expensive or supply becomes limited…I believe it wil not be any form of a steam engine that will be used for a replacement…Electric engines under catenary would be my guess to replace the diesel. Or a process of manufacturing some sort of fuel from coal…{liquid}, would be developed.